MCMANUS family of Keadue / Keadew

[Ted McManus]

My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>(Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>
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kinbote31@home.com

[Michael McManus]

: My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>Ted,<p>The Keadue church records show Patrick’s baptism on 2.2.1878. Parents John McManus and Bridget McCormic (sic). Witnesses were Martin McManus and Elizabeth Tounsk. The Townland is shown as Keadue. There are no entries relating to John and Bridget’s marriage and none regarding their other children that I can see.<p>Best wishes,<p>Michael.<br>

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<ul><li><a href="http://www.dur.ac.uk/~dss6mm/">Web pages of Dr. Michael McManus, University of Durham, England</a></ul>
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Michael.McManus@durham.ac.uk

[Ann]

: My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>Ted.....I knew Michael would be there to help with the name McManus...some additional information.....I found Michael born on March 19th to John Mc Manus and Brigida Mc Cormack....townland is Keadue West<p>

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[ann]

: My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>Found Elizabeth born July 19th 1891 in Keadue West

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[Ted McManus]

: My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>Michael and Ann, thank you so kindly for these lookups of Patrick, Michael and Elizabeth! I've also received two private emails referring me to Kilronan parish records on LDS film #1279224, which I will obtain and read closely.<p>A question: How much stock should I put in people's declarations of age? I ask because I've found passenger ship manifests at www.ellisisland.org for my people travelling from Keadue to Utica, NY:<p>1) Patrick, age declared as 21, on April 15, 1900<br>2) Patrick, 25 y, on May 4, 1905<br>3) Elizabeth, 11y 6 m, on May 4, 1905<br>4) An identical set to 2&3 for Patrick and Elizabeth on May 6, 1905 (they are neatly crossed off the May 4 manifest and apparently(?) did not actually sail on that ship.)<p>These are close, but don't quite match up with the dates you've generously researched for Patrick (bap. 2 Feb 1878) and Elizabeth (born 19 July 1891) -- such an Elizabeth should report herself as nearly 14 in May 1905 and such a Patrick as 27, no? On the plus side, the difference in their ages does correspond, if not their absolute ages. But I'm new to this sort of research, so I don't know how much wiggle room to allow for. Could there be a duplicate Patrick/Elizabeth with parents of the same name and the same age difference in such a small place a Keadue? That just doesn't seem likely, does it?<p>In the 1901 Census here at the L-R website, there's a McManus entry in Keadew West with Bridget, age 50, listed as head of household (her occupation is colorfully listed as "widow/lunatic"), with Patrick (24) and Elizabeth (10) also in the house. The age difference again corresponds well, but the absolute ages given correspond better to your birth/baptismal records than to my ship manifest entries.<p>Yet the birth record found by Ann for Michael on the exact right date does firmly establish the parents as John and Bridget, and so the Patrick and Elizabeth birth/bap/census records with the same parents look very credible.<p>Would there be any reason to intentionally give inaccurate ages on the ship? Might children under 12 travel at a reduced rate, for instance?<p>Please forgive my many questions and general ignorance. As I mentioned, I'm still quite new. Your generous aid to a total stranger has been wonderful, and is most appreciated!<p>- Ted<br>

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kinbote31@home.com

[Michael McManus]

: : My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: : Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: : I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: : (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>: Michael and Ann, thank you so kindly for these lookups of Patrick, Michael and Elizabeth! I've also received two private emails referring me to Kilronan parish records on LDS film #1279224, which I will obtain and read closely.<p>: A question: How much stock should I put in people's declarations of age? I ask because I've found passenger ship manifests at www.ellisisland.org for my people travelling from Keadue to Utica, NY:<p>: 1) Patrick, age declared as 21, on April 15, 1900<br>: 2) Patrick, 25 y, on May 4, 1905<br>: 3) Elizabeth, 11y 6 m, on May 4, 1905<br>: 4) An identical set to 2&3 for Patrick and Elizabeth on May 6, 1905 (they are neatly crossed off the May 4 manifest and apparently(?) did not actually sail on that ship.)<p>: These are close, but don't quite match up with the dates you've generously researched for Patrick (bap. 2 Feb 1878) and Elizabeth (born 19 July 1891) -- such an Elizabeth should report herself as nearly 14 in May 1905 and such a Patrick as 27, no? On the plus side, the difference in their ages does correspond, if not their absolute ages. But I'm new to this sort of research, so I don't know how much wiggle room to allow for. Could there be a duplicate Patrick/Elizabeth with parents of the same name and the same age difference in such a small place a Keadue? That just doesn't seem likely, does it?<p>: In the 1901 Census here at the L-R website, there's a McManus entry in Keadew West with Bridget, age 50, listed as head of household (her occupation is colorfully listed as "widow/lunatic"), with Patrick (24) and Elizabeth (10) also in the house. The age difference again corresponds well, but the absolute ages given correspond better to your birth/baptismal records than to my ship manifest entries.<p>: Yet the birth record found by Ann for Michael on the exact right date does firmly establish the parents as John and Bridget, and so the Patrick and Elizabeth birth/bap/census records with the same parents look very credible.<p>: Would there be any reason to intentionally give inaccurate ages on the ship? Might children under 12 travel at a reduced rate, for instance?<p>: Please forgive my many questions and general ignorance. As I mentioned, I'm still quite new. Your generous aid to a total stranger has been wonderful, and is most appreciated!<p>: - Ted<p>Ted,<p>I'm no real expert but I think it is best never to accept anything as given. Questioning everything makes for good research. There are so many McManuses in Kilronan, and so many recurring first names, that it is often impossible to come to any firm conclusions about some individuals. But there comes a time when you have to accept and trust what the record shows otherwise you don't progress. You will find that the Keadue church records are not inclusive of all the years. I recall it is the period between 1829 and 1836 which is completely missing. What chance have we got?<p>Michael.

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Michael.McManus@durham.ac.uk

[Ann]

: : My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: : Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: : I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: : (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>: Michael and Ann, thank you so kindly for these lookups of Patrick, Michael and Elizabeth! I've also received two private emails referring me to Kilronan parish records on LDS film #1279224, which I will obtain and read closely.<p>: A question: How much stock should I put in people's declarations of age? I ask because I've found passenger ship manifests at www.ellisisland.org for my people travelling from Keadue to Utica, NY:<p>: 1) Patrick, age declared as 21, on April 15, 1900<br>: 2) Patrick, 25 y, on May 4, 1905<br>: 3) Elizabeth, 11y 6 m, on May 4, 1905<br>: 4) An identical set to 2&3 for Patrick and Elizabeth on May 6, 1905 (they are neatly crossed off the May 4 manifest and apparently(?) did not actually sail on that ship.)<p>: These are close, but don't quite match up with the dates you've generously researched for Patrick (bap. 2 Feb 1878) and Elizabeth (born 19 July 1891) -- such an Elizabeth should report herself as nearly 14 in May 1905 and such a Patrick as 27, no? On the plus side, the difference in their ages does correspond, if not their absolute ages. But I'm new to this sort of research, so I don't know how much wiggle room to allow for. Could there be a duplicate Patrick/Elizabeth with parents of the same name and the same age difference in such a small place a Keadue? That just doesn't seem likely, does it?<p>: In the 1901 Census here at the L-R website, there's a McManus entry in Keadew West with Bridget, age 50, listed as head of household (her occupation is colorfully listed as "widow/lunatic"), with Patrick (24) and Elizabeth (10) also in the house. The age difference again corresponds well, but the absolute ages given correspond better to your birth/baptismal records than to my ship manifest entries.<p>: Yet the birth record found by Ann for Michael on the exact right date does firmly establish the parents as John and Bridget, and so the Patrick and Elizabeth birth/bap/census records with the same parents look very credible.<p>: Would there be any reason to intentionally give inaccurate ages on the ship? Might children under 12 travel at a reduced rate, for instance?<p>: Please forgive my many questions and general ignorance. As I mentioned, I'm still quite new. Your generous aid to a total stranger has been wonderful, and is most appreciated!<p>: - Ted<p><br>Ted....I rechecked Elizabeth's entry in the Kilronan church records. The date is the same July 19 1891. I have often come across differences in dates from one record to another. The census records appeared in some cases to be rounded up to a multiple of 5 like 50 or <br>55.<p>I see that your family members Michael and Martin returned from a trip home on the SS Cedric that docked August 14 1910....Michael is listed as 21 and Martin as 28. How do these ages compare with those on their initial trip?<p>the years 1879 through 1882 are missing in the Kilronan records. These may have been the years that some of the children were born. <br>

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[Ted McManus]

Hi Ann,<p>: I see that your family members Michael and Martin returned from a trip home on the SS Cedric that docked August 14 1910....Michael is listed as 21 and Martin as 28. How do these ages compare with those on their initial trip?<p>That age of 21 in the ellis island database for Michael on the 1910 voyage is actually misread from the manifest. Examination of the scanned image shows that it's really 26, with a faint loop on the 6. His trip in 1900 (he sailed from Queenstown on 29 April 1900 aboard the Etruria, arrived 6 May) shows him as 16. So Michael is very consistent: born in 1884, 16 yo in 1900, 26 yo in 1910. <p>I haven't yet found Martin's initial trip. That 1910 manifest showing him as 28 years old is my only record for him so far. It's a broadly informative record though, showing that Patrick had by then moved to 105 East Clark St, Ilion, NY and providing what I'm guessing are naturalization dates(?) and court locations for passengers labelled "USC" (US Citizens?), including both my McManuses. I expect that manifest image may help lead me to naturalization records for Michael and Martin.<p>Some of these McManuses, though I don't know which ones, are reportedly buried in St Agnes cemetery in Utica, so the next time I'm back in NY I will go collect data from headstones. (At present I am in Wisconsin.)<p>: the years 1879 through 1882 are missing in the Kilronan records. These may have been the years that some of the children were born. <p>That's disappointing, but good to know. Thank you again for all these lookups.<br>
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kinbote31@home.com

[Ann]

: Hi Ann,<p>: : I see that your family members Michael and Martin returned from a trip home on the SS Cedric that docked August 14 1910....Michael is listed as 21 and Martin as 28. How do these ages compare with those on their initial trip?<p>: That age of 21 in the ellis island database for Michael on the 1910 voyage is actually misread from the manifest. Examination of the scanned image shows that it's really 26, with a faint loop on the 6. His trip in 1900 (he sailed from Queenstown on 29 April 1900 aboard the Etruria, arrived 6 May) shows him as 16. So Michael is very consistent: born in 1884, 16 yo in 1900, 26 yo in 1910. <p>: I haven't yet found Martin's initial trip. That 1910 manifest showing him as 28 years old is my only record for him so far. It's a broadly informative record though, showing that Patrick had by then moved to 105 East Clark St, Ilion, NY and providing what I'm guessing are naturalization dates(?) and court locations for passengers labelled "USC" (US Citizens?), including both my McManuses. I expect that manifest image may help lead me to naturalization records for Michael and Martin.<p>: Some of these McManuses, though I don't know which ones, are reportedly buried in St Agnes cemetery in Utica, so the next time I'm back in NY I will go collect data from headstones. (At present I am in Wisconsin.)<p>: : the years 1879 through 1882 are missing in the Kilronan records. These may have been the years that some of the children were born. <p>: That's disappointing, but good to know. Thank you again for all these lookups.<p>Ted.....I think i saw a Mark Mc Manus on the Ellis Island site....check this out....it looks like it might be Martin.......good luck

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[Ann]

: : My g-grandfather was Patrick MCMANUS (b. 1879?). He had siblings Martin (b. 1882?), Michael (b. 19 Mar 1884), Elizabeth (b. Dec 1893?) and supposedly also John and Mary (no data yet).<p>: : Patrick, Martin, Michael and Elizabeth are documented as departing Keadue, Co. Roscommon to join an Uncle Thomas MCCORMACK or MCCORMICK in Utica, Co. Oneida, New York, USA between 1900-1905. John and Mary also crossed, but remain undocumented. I believe the parents remained in Ireland.<p>: : I would like to identify the parents in Keadue. Does this group of offspring sound familiar to anyone?<p>: : (Additional info: I am told Mary wed a McCorm?ck, and John wed a Helen Pinkerton QUIGLEY. My ggf Patrick wed a Josephine MURTHA who crossed over from Co. Sligo.)<p>: Michael and Ann, thank you so kindly for these lookups of Patrick, Michael and Elizabeth! I've also received two private emails referring me to Kilronan parish records on LDS film #1279224, which I will obtain and read closely.<p>: A question: How much stock should I put in people's declarations of age? I ask because I've found passenger ship manifests at www.ellisisland.org for my people travelling from Keadue to Utica, NY:<p>: 1) Patrick, age declared as 21, on April 15, 1900<br>: 2) Patrick, 25 y, on May 4, 1905<br>: 3) Elizabeth, 11y 6 m, on May 4, 1905<br>: 4) An identical set to 2&3 for Patrick and Elizabeth on May 6, 1905 (they are neatly crossed off the May 4 manifest and apparently(?) did not actually sail on that ship.)<p>: These are close, but don't quite match up with the dates you've generously researched for Patrick (bap. 2 Feb 1878) and Elizabeth (born 19 July 1891) -- such an Elizabeth should report herself as nearly 14 in May 1905 and such a Patrick as 27, no? On the plus side, the difference in their ages does correspond, if not their absolute ages. But I'm new to this sort of research, so I don't know how much wiggle room to allow for. Could there be a duplicate Patrick/Elizabeth with parents of the same name and the same age difference in such a small place a Keadue? That just doesn't seem likely, does it?<p><br>Ted.....Found John Mc Manus born February 16 1888 to John Mc Manus and Brigida Mc Cormick<br>: In the 1901 Census here at the L-R website, there's a McManus entry in Keadew West with Bridget, age 50, listed as head of household (her occupation is colorfully listed as "widow/lunatic"), with Patrick (24) and Elizabeth (10) also in the house. The age difference again corresponds well, but the absolute ages given correspond better to your birth/baptismal records than to my ship manifest entries.<p>: Yet the birth record found by Ann for Michael on the exact right date does firmly establish the parents as John and Bridget, and so the Patrick and Elizabeth birth/bap/census records with the same parents look very credible.<p>: Would there be any reason to intentionally give inaccurate ages on the ship? Might children under 12 travel at a reduced rate, for instance?<p>: Please forgive my many questions and general ignorance. As I mentioned, I'm still quite new. Your generous aid to a total stranger has been wonderful, and is most appreciated!<p>: - Ted<p>

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[Ann]

Ted.....Found John Mc Manus born February 16 1888 to John Mc Manus and Brigida Mc Cormick
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[Ted McManus]

: Ted.....Found John Mc Manus born February 16 1888 to John Mc Manus and Brigida Mc Cormick<p>That's fantastic, Ann -- thanks much! Where have you been finding these? In the Kilronan parish records? Elsewhere?<p>I took your suggestion to look at the Mark voyages at the Ellis Island site, and while he is joining a brother Patrick the address for Mark's Patrick is down in New York City both in 1908 and 1911, which would be an unexpected locale for him, and which conflicts with his known location in 1910 in the middle of that span.<p>The 1910 Michael/Martin manifest places Patrick up in Ilion NY, not far from Utica and pretty much where I expected him to be. So I'm thinking Mark there is probably not Martin -- but it was certainly worth checking out, and I've taken notes in case other evidence arises later.<br>

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kinbote31@home.com

[Ann]

Ted.....When I reviewed the film you mentioned, I made xerox copies of it so that I could have a reference close by. My research is in the Kilronan Parish too.<p>My copies of the Tithe records from 1835 show that in Keadue (Peyton) there lived a Patrick McManus; in Keadue(Regan) I see a Patrick Mc Manus and 2 Michael McManus names. I do not know which of these two places listed are keadue east and west. However, It would appear that John Mc Manus (the father) may have been the son of a Patrick or a Michael.<p>Good luck!
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